Personal Redemption

Welcome back to Chuck Grafree Radio. Uh in our last episode, we discussed the Shawshank Redemption and how uh we often create mental prisons around ourselves. Um and one of the things that uh came out of that discussion uh was a desire to have a conversation with somebody who had spent time incarcerated. And so we're uh delighted to have on one of Ray's friends, Bryant Pogue.

My guy got to know him the last year, um even before then, right? Yeah. Um he was in New York though, yeah. And I was over here. So I always heard this guy from New York with a with a tough accent. Like, who's Brian Brian? But um yeah, when I came back to the company, you welcomed me in open arms and you know, taught me the ropes again because I was lost in the sauce. Yeah. And um, yeah, just a person who I've seen over the past year just persevere and um always hold their head high, even when I have my head low. So appreciate that. That was a that was a nice time, and you giving me pointers, you know, even even light pointers, and I just be like, he'd just be like, you basically don't take don't take no uh don't no shit, Ray. And I was like, all right, but so yeah, yeah, I remember those. Well they just don't walk over you.

Yeah, I remember those pointers. Yeah, it's been a pleasure. Definitely been a pleasure working with you, getting to know you, you as well.

Yeah. Yo, thank you for joining us. Yeah. Um, so yeah, maybe just some quick background, like you know, where you where you grew up.

Um Brian Polk, um from Brooklyn, New York. Uh, born and raised. Uh got some time spent in uh the Bronx after my stint in jail. Basically came home, went straight to the Bronx. Then been in Brooklyn ever since, but love New York. Uh, been working for my company going on what, nine years? Uh, that's why I'm basically out here in Massachusetts right now because of my job, my career. Um, but yeah, just been working ever since I got out and just been focused on just doing the right thing and just helping people and just staying positive, honestly. That's the main thing. Raising my two daughters, that's the main thing. My two daughters, my two princesses. I'm real family, man, real family oriented, the way I grew up. So that's just me, honestly.

So what year did you go in?

Uh went in 2006, man. 16 years old. Came home 2016 at 26.

That's a perfect time to come up. Yeah.

July 12th, this year makes 10 years I've been home.

That's fire.

So 10 years in, 10 years out. Probably see if you do a little celebration or something.

Yeah. You know, but uh You came out when Fetty Wap came out. When Fetty Wap had his run in 2016.

That's why it's a girl that works with me that's a huge fan of Fetty Wap. I can't really get into it so much.

That was bro.

I heard 2016 was a vibe.

And you had Drake that that year too, with one dance and controller and all that.

Oh, yeah, 2016 was a vibe most definitely. I didn't care what was out. As long as I was out, I was out. You know what I'm saying? Um, I was just happy to be out 2016. Yeah. Um, but yeah, it was uh it was a blessing, it was a good transition to come out, honestly. So yeah, it was good.

Yeah, so yeah, I mean, and just in terms of the specifics, you know, I think you mentioned you spent some time at Rikers, and then I you know, where where were you after that?

Um they I would they'll call me a journeyman in jail. Uh, I spent 16 months on Rikers Island fighting my case. Um, when I finally got sentenced, CASAC is my first jail. I can't remember every jail I've been to, but I've been to a whole bunch of jails. When I first went up there as an adolescent, still young.

Why do they do that? Why do they have you change?

No, it's basically about what you do to switch jails a lot. Like if you get into fights in and out of the box, they'll ship you further. So sometimes, depending on your jail, like with me, it started me like three years away, away from where I was, like I lived, three years, three and a half. When I got in trouble, they sent me fur. Like, and then the Morrison with 10 and a half hours away. Um, and then from there, just bouncing around. I actually got into an incident when I got close, then shut shipped back further up away. So it's like a punishment. The good you the good behavior you are, you come down.

It's like to keep you away from like ties, because you might be closer to the people that are.

It's like punishment, most definitely. Like they say, like with the feds, they don't even put you in the same state. So it's like with the state, they send you further away, like to make it a hassle for your parents. So you're basically by yourself. So it's rough out there. It's like it's important to have communication with your people because it's like when the prisoners see that you don't have no outside contact, yeah, they treat you the way they want to treat you and they pay attention to that. So you want to try to stay close to to your to your family while you're in there.

Uh you know, there's there's a lot of uh you know, representations in the media of what life in prison is like. You know, I mean I'm sure you've seen a lot of that that stuff. I mean, from from your experience, what's um you know, what's kind of real and maybe what's what's less so.

Prison is honestly what they say is like I would say is what you make it. How you are is the type of things you're gonna get into. If you going in there to really mind your business, um you can have a smooth, easy bid. Um it's the people that's trying to poke their chest out, trying to still stay involved and things of that nature. Um, when you see certain things on TV, I can't speak for outside of New York or anything like that, but a lot of it be fake. Um you're just talking about this generation, the type of people that's in jail, um, they not raping and stuff like that. They're eventually gonna come home. Now, as far as like the older people that have been in jail years, they not really doing it. If they are, it's like that's where they live. So they chilling, they not really going crazy like that. Um but um it all depends on the type of person you are. You're gonna make it what you make it, really tell you the truth. And um it's I've heard that too.

I've heard like New York is different than like Yeah, it's like I watched it. Y'all gonna say pause, like, nah, we're not doing that.

Yeah, we're not doing a lot of that stuff. I went in at a young age, so um, and then I came home, not at an older age, but I was kind of more mature at 26. Um, so I spent a lot of time around older people, spent time around younger people when I was older. Um, it's all about what you make it, honestly. Tell you the truth. I done seen some things happen for no reason. Like, honestly, if you look at my cut, I got cut for no reason if I when I tell you a story. Um, so it's like certain things like that will happen and could happen. But other than that, it's what you make it. Jail is like they they doing the right thing by portraying it to be so horrible, so you make you don't want to go in there. Yeah, but it depends on like the hardest part is being away from your family. I'm real family-oriented, so that's like the hardest part of being in there and having to depend on people. Yeah, you gotta ask for stuff and things of that nature.

Yeah, commissary and stuff, right?

Yeah, so but other than that, it's like it's what you make it, tell you the truth.

Yeah, and I'm I'm just curious, like the the experience in in jail versus you know, post post-trial incarceration, is it like a is it a huge difference or yeah, it's a huge difference, depending on how much time you did in there.

I mean, I did take like which was worse. What the experience going in or the experience coming out, the transition you mean?

No, no, just like being being in in at Rikers versus you know after trial, yeah.

That experience is totally different. Uh like I I was on Rikers Island at a young age, and adolescent, and adolescent is totally different. The mentality is totally different when you're dealing with adults. And adults, you could go in there and just mind your business and chill and be easy. And adolescent is not like that. Um, it's not like that at all. If you was to go in there on Rikers Island and think you're gonna be quiet and easy, um, just mind your business, you're gonna end up washing drawers, getting beat up. You have people called day room dummies, where it's like people get bored and beat you up for no reason. So it's rough. So it's like if you really not, what they say is about that life, you're gonna have a rough time on Rikers Island. You know what I'm saying? You're gonna really have a rough time. Now, that transition going upstate, depending on the type of lifestyle you lived on Rikers Island, it follows you.

Yeah.

So if you was like one of those type of people where you used to extort people, terrorize people, do have them doing all sorts of crazy stuff, a lot of older people hear about that upstate. And they wait for you to come upstate, honestly. Um, I don't know how it is now because I've been out for a while, but the transition going upstate is way smoother. Like you going up there to do your time now. You have, depending on who you are, depending on what you're into, that's the type of stuff you're gonna get into. Did you keep it cool at Rikers? Rikers Island, honestly, no, I didn't. Honestly, I I fell into I gotta be part of this in order to survive. Yeah. So it's like I had to fight. I had to really show them that you can't bully me. What made it rough for me was like I was the only one in my neighborhood locked up.

Yeah.

So I didn't really know much people, but I can honestly say I wish I didn't, but it's like if I didn't, I don't think I would have survived on Records Island the way I did. Because you couldn't be quiet. You had to fight. It was rough. It was rough. Um but I went to two buildings on Records Island because I was fighting a uh uh possession of a drugs case. So I went to a sentence building, which was kind of smoother. Um, but then when they sent me back when they found out that my charge was still open for the other case, I bounced around to Capitol's Restraint and all sorts of other jails on Rikers Island. And then I finally went up once I got sentenced to the 12 years.

You ever um you ever been in the box? Yeah, a few times. How how is like explain that like because I mean it'd be like just being in a like black room, like in in a just dark room by yourself, but explain that like in dark room but jail. Like you can't walk out, you know what I mean? You can't go to it's not like a bathroom, you know what I mean? Like it's not like a bathroom in your house, you can't just walk out. Yeah, it's it's the size of the bathroom.

I was about to say it's definitely the size of the bathroom. Um, I spent a few times in the box. Honestly, it was the time where it's like every time doing a ball drop, I was in a box. Like my mom told me it was like the first time I wasn't in the box doing a ball drop, she congratulated me. Um but it's crazy in the box. You could go crazy in there if you really don't have it all, if you don't have nothing to do, because you're really by yourself and you only really go outside for the for one hour of the day. So mentally that destroy anybody.

You like talk to yourself?

I still talk to myself to this day. So it's like I ain't look at that, I don't look at that as crazy, tell you the truth. Um, but yes, I talked to myself, read a bunch of books, push-ups, and stuff of that nature. You gotta do certain things to keep you occupied, whole writing a whole bunch of letters. Um, you'll find out, you you you sit there and talk to yourself and learn about yourself in a box. But it's it's horrible. It's something that I don't think nobody should actually go through.

Yeah, what was your longest stint in there?

Five months. It wasn't, I ain't never do nothing crazy, like you hear all the stories about people. I was in there with somebody that was in there from the time I was born. I was born in 88. He was in a box since like 85. What? Yeah, man. It's stories of these people in there, it's like, what the hell do they do to deserve what they going through? But um, it's some monsters in jail. Like, you know how they say I don't wish jail on nobody, it's certain people that actually belong in there. For real.

Loki, I I think we've had this conversation before. I think if somebody like, I think everybody deserves a second chance, but like if you even even after you get the second chance, you commit and keep doing like the horrible things. What I consider horrible is like, you know, yeah, grape and all those things, you know what I mean? Like drugs, uh I don't really care about that, bro. But like that things like that nature, I I think you deserve to be put down, bro. Yeah. I'm sorry, like I I feel like there's no there's there's no instance in this world where like that is necessary in this world, you know what I mean?

Yeah, certain things is just inhumane, honestly. Tell you the truth. You hear certain stories, even with me being home and watching certain things like first 48. You know what I'm saying? Certain things like that, like oh nah, he's a monster. How could you?

You ever watch shows like that and you be like, Is is it you think it's like real, like real for most of it?

Yeah, a lot of a lot of that stuff be, I mean, um, as far as what the what they getting locked up for, because they don't really show what's going on in jail, but um a lot of these people cases that I be seeing, it's like, yeah, they deserve to be in jail.

Yeah.

You know what I'm saying? Like, that's why I like I hear people say, like, I won't wish that on certain certain people belonging there.

Yeah.

For real. Because it's like certain crimes, it's like, how could you? Like, mentally, what's wrong with you? So I understand it now sometimes.

Did you ever, um, when you were in there, did you have a relationship with God?

Not really so much, honestly. When you speak about relationship, um, nah, I can't.

You never prayed, you've never been like just holding hold me over.

The funny thing is, the last time I prayed, the last time I remember specifically, the last time I got on, bend it down on my knees and prayed, was I got into an incident in jail where I got cut and um I defended myself afterwards, not to get too much into it. And um, they came to myself, it was like the homeboy was fighting for his life. Now, mind you, I'm in jail for it. So it's like, that's another one. I can't do that. You know what I'm saying? So I was like, I got down and I and just prayed, like, just talked, please. Don't let him die. You know what I'm saying? We don't need him to die, can't do that much more time. Like, and that's the last time I ever got down on my hands and knees.

Um even we had we had to talk at the table at um at our manager meeting, we just talk about faith.

Yeah.

You you have had to have like faith and hope and all those things, like the whole time, you know what I mean? Like, cause like I get it, like there's probably a part of you where it's like I gotta be that, like I gotta be that person, like the macho man. But like when you sat there and you like thought about it almost every night, like you was like, please, like, let's I gotta make this, I gotta make out of it.

I mean, honestly, it's like with me growing up, I grew up in the church, yeah, but it wasn't so much of a like a choice growing up. It was like I was just growing because my mom's my pops. So they was religious people, not so deep into it, so that's why it wasn't so much forced on me as far as like I never was too religious when I did believe in God. Um, but um, yeah, I never really thought about it, honestly. I just went about my life in there and focused on what I had to focus on because I couldn't really focus on nothing else while I was in there. Yeah, honestly. Um, but I did have faith, and you opened my eyes when you told me that, because I was looking at like I'm not religious, anything to that nature. And you was like, you have you have faith. In order to have faith, you get what I'm saying, you have to have some type of religious background, and you made a lot of sense. Um even to this day, um it's the same, tell you the truth. Yeah, it just gave me some confidence picking up who I'm who I am and things of that nature and believing who I believe in.

Yeah, I mean, what you know dur during your time, like what was the biggest surprise?

That it was honestly one of the biggest surprises in there was running to certain personalities. Because you know, when you're in society, you surround yourself with who you want to surround yourself with. So you don't even see certain things until you're around people that you have no choice to be around, and you like and you start seeing characteristics that you never saw before, not even on TV. So that's the was like the biggest surprise. Like, I'm surprised that they make people like you. Like, I'm surprised. Like, that was like the biggest surprise.

Like, I'm honestly surprised that see a dude like Joker, and then I'm like, shit.

Yeah, it's like even Joker, like just seeing people the way they are, seeing people doing the things that they do. It's like how, like, where you pick that up from things of that nature, like where, who? So I was really like diving deep into people for a minute because it's like I couldn't believe I was surrounded by certain people.

Yeah, joining psychology class in there.

Oh man, it was crazy. And then I honestly tell you the truth. Um, just dealing with all different types of personalities. It's like you have to think for other people, and it's like driving when you say you gotta think for other people when you're driving. You have to think for other people in there because you'll find yourself caught up in all sorts of stuff, honestly.

Yeah, so I I'm I'm curious just that that first night, whether whether at Rikers or when you were upstate, I mean, what was it like?

My first night on Rikers Island, I was kind of nervous. Um I'm not gonna fry, I was I was scared because it's the environment is a dorm. And then it's like up until going to sleep, you hear all sorts of stories about what's gonna happen, what could happen.

Oh, it wasn't it wasn't a sale?

Hell nah, it wasn't a sale, so that's why I was so nervous. No, that's scary, bro. Yeah, so it's like you sleep in a bunch of around a bunch of adolescents, teenagers, some of them locked up for the things you locked up over. So it's like that's nerve-wracking. You get what I'm saying? It's like I'm surprised I actually did go to sleep. Um, my first night, honestly, sleeping when I got upstate and I finished the process of going back and forth to court and everything. I slept good. It was like some of the best sleep I ever experienced because now it's like a lot of the stuff that I knew I was running from or going through is over. So now I've got a whole nother chapter I'm about to get started with. And I actually slept good, honestly. But Rikers Island was the worst. It's the worst, honestly. After you leave mod one, and then you go to your cell.

And that's another Did you like count the days? Or like did you have to forget about the days that way? I forgot about it. The time will go by quicker.

Yeah, I forgot about it. I just try to stay focused, honestly, and stay busy. Program. Like one of the things I said that was positive about being in jail was you stayed programmed and you stayed busy, you stayed doing something. Um, and I ain't pay attention to the days until I knew I was getting close to it when I had like five years left. And then once I knew I was doing programs to get me home earlier, that's when I actually started counting down the days.

Yeah.

But I really just was one, I'm always one of those people that just focus on what's in front of me, honestly.

Did you do any like schooling in there? Did they have that?

Yeah, that's how I actually got home earlier. I was doing NYU. So you have college in a lot of jails. That's why I say if you really focus on rehabilitating in there, you could get stuff in order. Um so I was in NYU with a bunch of people in um, I forgot what jail, Mount McGregor, I want to say that's the jail I came home from. I forgot. Um, and that's the only thing, it's that, and it's like another program for violent offenders you could do to get home earlier. Um, I was uh uh uh I taught phase three, I taught all sorts of stuff, but that was got me out of the school, uh, out of jail earlier, six months off my time. So yeah. And it was a good experience, you know, being in college, I actually liked it. Like those conversations.

Did you get like a certificate or something for it?

No, I actually didn't follow through with it. I'm what I I did it, you had to earn 21 credits to get home. So I earned my 21 credits when I came home. Um, of course, you got the opportunity to go back, but my whole thing was I had to really just get to working. Yeah, yeah. So I was on some DMX. I couldn't, can't you know books, dog? Yeah, so it's like I got straight to work and honestly I would just focus. Um, but yeah, college definitely helped while being in there.

So so I'm curious. I mean, 10 years in there, I mean, what what was it like just coming out? You know, like did it feel like things were the same, or did it feel, you know, I I asked because like, I mean, I think literally the iPhone was introduced when you were in there.

Yeah, I still don't know how to work my phone that I got, honestly. Um I was scared coming out because you gotta remember I went in as a what you would say, a little a baby. I went in as a baby. Um, my mom was everybody that took care of me was still alive to the point where it's like I never went to a doctor's appointment by myself. So now I'm coming home to do all that by myself. Everybody's gone. Um, my father's the only person that was alive. All my grandparents passed away. So, and my father can't, me and him wasn't on the best of terms. So now it's basically I just really got my brothers and the people around me to help, but I was one of those type of people that didn't like to ask for help. So that's what made the transition harder. Me not wanting help from people. Um, but it was hard. I was scared. Um, it was nerve-wracking because you're dealing with the same thing that you dealt with in there as far as being out in the world of being around the different personalities that you're not used to. Because of course I didn't really go back to where my my old neighborhood and lived there, anything like that. So I ventured off and started doing other stuff, and now I'm around other people doing other stuff. So it was kind of scary, scary. But honestly, once I got my feet wet, it was like, all right, I'm focused.

Did you ever get the itch to like yeah, you know what I mean?

Yeah, I temptation to go back to the old, yeah, I did. Um dibbling, dabbling in certain things, but it's like it's still, I think everything happened for a reason. So you go through certain things that make you wake up. Like I always got say certain things, like, my God is my mom, so she has do certain things or put certain obstacles in front of me that say, Boy, what you doing?

Yeah.

So of course, temptation is definitely gonna be there. Especially if like you're trying to accomplish a whole bunch of goals and a lot of pressure on you, you seem like But once I realized it wasn't no pressure on me, I just stayed focused on myself and got to it.

How's being a dad?

You make all your decisions based on that.

Yeah. I was about to say that like when your first daughter was was probably like when you found out she was pregnant, that probably like activated a different switch.

Yeah, it definitely did. Um I always say, like, you're not a man until you have kids because you start living for other people outside of yourself. Get what I'm saying. So it's like it makes you not not not to say that you're not a man, but it's like um, because I know a whole bunch of people that don't have kids, but it's like I just doubted myself. Not like that, but it's like uh it makes you it makes you think differently when you know you have somebody else's life in your hands and you're responsible for somebody else. So it's like all the things that you used to do, you had to probably stop because now it's like you gotta watch how it interfere with that person's life. You know what I'm saying? But it's everything. I love it. It it makes me who I am. It's a beautiful feeling.

I mean, from what I be saying, you look like the best dad in the world, bruh. Like, I mean, I try to be always happy.

I try to do the best I could. Um that's why I got my decision on going back to New York because of them at the end of the day. I mean, it's rough being away from them when you were around them a lot. But um, and at this age where they at, it's like I feel like they need me in their life. You know what I'm saying? But um, yeah. Kids is beautiful.

Yeah, uh what one of the things we were talking about beforehand was just um just you know the temptations that are available even within prison, you know, whether it's alcohol, drugs, whatever. I I'm just curious, like how does it even get in?

A lot of times uh it get in because of the COs, a lot of times. Um you see how they say how how the back in the day they say the uh the government gave us the the coke and the drugs and the guns, it's the same way in there most of the time.

It's uh this the C watch uh Mayor Kingston.

Nah, I didn't see that.

It's basically what the COs do. And I I wanted to ask you that.

Like, yeah, do they do they really bring bring bring stuff in there? I mean, I remember when you ever heard of K2? Yeah, isn't yeah, it's isn't it like uh it's like a synthetic drug supposed to be like an incense that people be smoking? Oh my when I first came home, um it was somebody, it was a CO in there, he was on the news and he was bringing in bags of it. Bags of it. So it's like you got inmates doing stuff too as well, like visitors coming in, sneaking things in and stuff like that. That was something I could never do, honestly. Yeah, because the way you gotta transfer it in. But um, I definitely indulged in some of the stuff, most definitely. But as far as me bringing it in and putting other people's lives and freedom on the line, I never did that. I never partook in bringing it in, but I indulged in it when it got in most of the time. Yeah. But it's yeah, mainly the CEO's side money because the type of money they could make from it is bringing it in is different. It's like four times the amount.

It's like it's own business in there, bro. It is. That is crazy.

It is. I mean, that's what makes jail crazy, is because it's like you going into a whole nother society. That's if you gotta do a lot of time, you gotta adapt to it fast. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? So it's it's crazy in there.

Yeah. Yeah. What was it like, like working, you know, like your relationship with the guards, with the, you know, administration? Like, what's it like day to day?

I could say when it comes to the CEOs and stuff, pr you ever heard of like prison one itself? We do everything. They just there to oversee things and make sure things don't get too much out of hand. But actually, it's like the the the prisoners run everything. Um, they just there to assist like the people that's about to go home, the programs and stuff like that. But my associations with them, I never really had any runners with them. I was nervous of them when I was young. Because when I was young, I was still affiliated in the gang. And they don't like gang members up there.

Yeah.

They don't like gang members up there. And like I was scared to go to a particular jail I heard too. Um, because they be killing people in Attica. It was a jail called Attica, and I was gang affiliated. The only good thing was I played sports, but see CEOs up there is vicious. That's why I spoke about earlier. Like, they pay attention to who have communications with their family. And if they see that you don't really have no communication with the outside world, and you think you're gonna run around and poke your chest out and cause havoc up there, you'll disappear fast. Fast immediately. And they won't care. So it's vicious up there, honestly. You really have to be on your P's and Q's, know who you're dealing with, because you gotta understand it's a lot of racism going up there still. Um, a lot of stuck shin still going up there. Um, so you still just gotta be on your P's and Q's and know what's going on and just stay out the way.

You ever watch Shaw Shank Redemption?

Yeah, I saw a little bit of that.

You know when Morgan Freeman goes and like like what like 10-year mark or whatever, and he keeps going back and they're like basically like, oh, like you rehabilitated, you can go out to the world. Did you ever have that? Like at like a five-year stint, or like, did you ever have like parole or something? Or like did they just make you do your full your full time?

It's funny. They would they would probably tell me my PO would probably say I was like the model um parole because like I was focused, bro. I ain't gonna hold you. I looked at it where it's like I got a second chance at life coming home early for the uh the charge I had. So it's like I had to really just stay focused and um how I would say I always say I'd not uh upset my mom. Even though she done passed away and all that, I didn't want to make it seem like she passed away in vain at the end of the day. Um so it's like I never really had outside my first year when I was still dribbling and dabbling, doing little things, and I had to really snap out of it fast and realize like you bugging out. You know what I'm saying? So it was easier for me than most people because I felt like my mom was still watching. Um I ain't get a second chance at at this for nothing. So I got to make the best of it. Then I still got my little brother, he looked up to me, still look up me up to me to this day. So it's like I had to stay focused.

When you got out, was it strictly at the company we're at now, or did you have a different job before then?

When I first got out, I went to a program that they have for people that first come out, like a rehabilitation program. Yeah, actually, they teach you how to do a whole bunch of stuff. Um, I started working at a restaurant. That was my first job ever. I mean, outside of a little summy, summy, yummy, they call it a summer job. That was my first job ever, working as a dishwasher. Um, I worked my way up to be a cook in there. Then I started doing a construction job. And I couldn't do both, honestly. It was killing me doing both jobs, being the cook and all that, and still doing construction. So with me, I made the mistake of quitting one job, and that was the most secure job. And I started doing construction, that was paying the most money. They let me go after probably the job was done like two months, then I was jobless, went on Craigslist, I started cleaning.

So I I I'm curious when you when you think back, you know, entering at 16, coming out at 26, you know, what you know, what do you like, what was the biggest change for you personally?

Realizing that everything was on me. Everything, I didn't have nobody really to lean on, no parents. Um, so it's like, and I really can't mess up as much no more now. Like, it's nobody there that could hold me down. Um, of course I had a girlfriend, I got my two brothers, but it's like it's still only on me. You know what I'm saying? Um, and I never really had that. Even in jail, it's like I was still like the little bro.

Yeah.

You know what I'm saying? So now it's like even when I come home for what I was locked up for, I'm not the little bro no more. Even though I got an older brother, but even the people in the streets is looking at me at a at a higher standard. So it's like I felt like it was a lot of pressure to perform and do good. Some people wanted me just go back to the streets and even do good out there. Whatever the case may be, my whole thing was I just got to do good and perform at the end of the day. But it was a lot of pressure, honestly. Um, just going to the DMV and just getting my uh my license and all that stuff was allowed for me. It was different. I've never been through it before.

Yeah.

So it's still some taking like a lot of things now, even up to this day. I'm 37, and it's still some things that it's like I wish they was here to show me certain things, but yeah, it is what it is.

Did you ever have that whole time any guilt or anger?

Hell yeah, I still have guilt. I I feel that I'm the reason my mom passed away. Yeah. Because before I got locked up, um, she was in the best of spirits. Nothing was wrong with her, she wasn't sick. Um, but soon I got locked up. I'm the middle child, I was like a baby. I was like her baby. Like, not to say I was a favorite, but I was like a baby. Her health started to deteriorate. And I always say stress is the number one killer. I feel that everybody asks me what she died from, I always say a broken heart. You know what I'm saying? Um, and then my little brother got locked up in the midst of me being locked up. So it was a lot on her. So I always feel to this day, I I take the blame for it. Um, that's why I felt that it was a lot of pressure on me not to honestly mess up, because the way I deal with life is she's my god and she sees everything. She sees me. So it's like I don't do nothing in life that she wants to prove of.

Yeah.

You know what I'm saying? So that's how I deal with life.

I was like that the other day. Quick story. Um, so we're we're planning on going to Cancun for uh like our big trip in May or whatever.

Yeah.

And I'm a procrastinator. So like the flights was up to like$5.50, like the past like two or three months. I'm like, oh my God, I'm not paying$5.50. And then I got an email and it said it was$3.10. And I said, thank you, Ma. Oh, because my mom, oh my mom's um death anniversary was Wednesday. And it literally, I got it at like got it at like 10 a.m. And I'm like, nah, you want me to go to Cancun?

I always do that. I always do that. People, I always talk to my moms. The other day I was talking to my girl and I said, Um God willing. She said, when you started saying God willing, I said, I always say that to my moms. Like, with how other people deal with their religion and look at their God, I looked at my moms that way.

Yeah.

So yeah, whatever gets you through.

Yeah.

Yeah. So yeah, I mean, any any um kind of words of advice for anyone out there facing, you know, time in prison. Let's stay focused.

Um, honestly, if you really want to succeed in society, you could really prepare yourself while you're in there. You could make the best out of your time. Like I told you, I was I've been to college while I was in there. So it's like you could really, really focus and get your shit together while you in while you're in there and stay focused. Because it's the transition could be as easy as you make it at the end of the day. Because if you're not preparing, it's like you hear when the ball drops and people make all these resolutions of what they're gonna do five days before the ball drop. You gotta mentally prepare yourself for certain things. Yeah, you're not just gonna do it. If you do do it, you're gonna do it for the first five days and stop. So you have to really mentally prepare yourself to say, all right, I'm about to come home and do good.

So basically, jail is not for weak-minded people. Because you're you're strong-minded. You you fought through all the that adversity and looked at the the greater good at the end.

Yeah, I mean, it's definitely not for the weak-minded people. You could get swallowed up in there, you could go in there and become a monster. You know what I'm saying? It depends on the things you go through, the people that you deal with, the situations you find yourself in. Um, but then it's like, like I said, it's all about what you make it because it's like everybody in there is not demons. You have some great people in there that just made mistakes. You know what I'm saying? If you surround yourself with some of those people or listen to certain stories, you find out what you really want for yourself and you prepare for it at the end of the day. Like, even the people that's gonna come home and do negative, they preparing themselves to come home and do negative by doing certain things in jail.

Yeah.

So if you want to come home and do positive, you're gonna prepare yourself by doing certain things in there as well. So it's all about what you make it, honestly, to tell you the truth. I just knew that I was spending a whole decade in there that I knew I wasn't coming home to do all sorts of stuff that I was doing prior. Get what I'm saying? So I couldn't, my whole thing was I couldn't let my mom's down.

Yeah.

So it's all about that's my message to anybody that's in jail. Just stay focused, come home, and and whatever you plan on doing when you get home, there's so many avenues in there and so many resources in there now, today, where like people got phones. You can learn AI in there, you can do anything you want in there, really tell you the truth. So it's like there's really no excuse to come home and mess up unless you want to, tell you the truth.

Yeah.

One minute. Yeah, you got you got anything else or nothing answered all my questions.

Yeah, no, this has been a great conversation. I'm happy I could answer all your questions. Any more of y'all just let me know. I'll come back. I got used to it.

Yeah, we got our minute of unconditional love to all beings.

I'm not gonna lie to you.

You ever just worked so much where you you could find yourself going to sleep just now? Definitely is about to doze off. That's what happened. You were at peace.

Alright, well, yeah, Ray, Ray, you got our quote, man.

You got anything that you lived by? Like your mom or anything said a quote to you ever?

I can't remember at the moment.

No? This one's about my goat, Drake.

Your goat?

Life is about figuring it out. Yeah. Simple. Life is about figuring it out.

Yeah.

I was gonna go like introspective, like deep one, but I'm like, I do that almost every time.

It was something that somebody be saying, oh, I heard it before. Do anything like it's everything is the opposite way. Do everything like it's anything. I like it was something, it was something to that where it just basically just don't matter what you're doing, just put 100% into it. Like, you don't know who's watching, just perform. Just perform.

Yeah. Well, Brian, yeah, thanks. Thanks a lot. I mean, this has been a great episode, you know. And hope, hopefully, somebody out there, you know, is getting some benefit from this. For sure.

Hopefully, we'll see. Yeah. I think somebody definitely picked up on the episode and learned something from it.

Yeah.

Yeah. All right.

Well, until next time, this is Chuck for Free Radio signing off.